Please submit any "especial" prophecies pertaining to Mormonism in the box below.
When I was younger the cold war was it's apex and the world was divided between communist and capitalism. What was taught to us little kids growing up in the womb of Mormonism is God would in time open up the communist countries and the people would flock to the true gospel in masses.
The iron curtain fell, Mormons sent in their missionaries and after a few years, not only didn't any masses of people flock to the church, but some Russians appealed to their government to throw the church out of their country.
Now Mormonism has stalled. Nobody who is sane wants to join it and more and more multi-generational mormons are leaving it. The world is changing and the US is losing it's political and economic position in the world to Asia and Asia is where the world focus is going to be in the 21st Century.
Mormonism is a has been. It has peaked and it will no longer grow thanks to the internet and the negative world image the US currently has around the world. The Mormon church always was a parasite riding on the back of Uncle Sam and most it's money comes from working American families.
Instead of investing around the world the church is spending billions to try and take control back in Salt Lake City trying to entice Mormons will money to buy property there. So much for Missouri and the last days. The Mormon church is building their vatican in Utah. Circling the wagons so to speak. This mean LDS Incorporated is taking a new defensive strategy focusing it's resources in a concentrated area that they are desperately still trying to control.
In time, they will even lose the battle in Utah as more and more non-Mormons move in, more Mormons leave the church, and it finally becomes diluted and either dies or morphs into something else to survive. I give it another 50 to 100 years.
The song "Book of Mormon Stories", will be tossed in the next decade. The Native American Tom Tom beat and the plain and precious Lamanite doctrine it contains are plain embarrassing.
I see the church becoming more and more acceptable to all faiths. Really watered down. Emphasis will evolve away from Joseph Smith and the early leaders. Absolute strictures of obedience will become more extreme. Hard core Mormonism will turn off rational members of the public, but excite radicals.
I see the church finally admitting serious flaws in its origins, but compartmentalizing in order to survive. As Jesus fails to return, I see new revelations about scientific toleration, including acceptance of the implanted microchip. I see the church getting more green than the most avid promoters of today. I see it becoming more and more cult-like, but balanced by the interest in growth.
I see the Facsimilies removed from the Standard Works. I see extended families allowed to attend sealings. The leadership will revert to simplicity and gut-originated speaking, rather than the use of teleprompters. The tradition of office-till-you-die will be changed, due to multiple cases of senility and shamefully disabled centenarians attempting to speak without breath.
I see the church succumb to the Internet and die a sudden death, due to a wildly successful combination of a bestselling book of fiction and a relentless comedian. Other than this, I really have no opinion. Et tu?
Dynamic growth is in the past, and very unlikely to return. - by Just Thinking
But the implosion predicted by some is not there either: there are just enough births and converts to maintain the necessary critical mass.
There will always be that subset of humanity that relies solely on 'the spirit' (emotion) to direct their lives. If Catholicism and Islam can last this long and continue to grow then so will Mormonism.
So now, with the GIFT OF PROPHECY endowed on me from both Zeus and Dyonysis I hereby proclaim:
* The whole Pearl of Great Price will be dropped from the scriptures.
* You will never hear of 'Lamanites' again
* The brightest and best members will continue to exit in droves leaving only the desperately gullible and naive (that's still quite a few)
* The corporate face of the Church will become ever more evident with mega-properties in the news
* Temples will be opened in a small way to non-members attending weddings
* A slow begrudging acceptance of gays beginning with 'Don't Ask/Don't tell'
* Joseph Smith will remain the cult's Savior with even more monuments and programs dedicated to his memory.
* The Church will be a last bastion holdout of racists, environment haters, global warming poo-pooers, gun lovers, internet porno watchers, Glenn Beck groupies, and wild-eyed right-wing conspiracy mongers,
* Missionary numbers will continue to drift downward, same with convert numbers.
* Branches and areas that don't produce enough tithing to at least pay their own way will be 'consolidated' and closed. More wards and stakes combined. The fiction of 'fastest growing church' will be maintained as long as possible then quietly discontinued after a program on 20/20 exposes the truth.
* The 'blessings' of paying a 20% tithing will be promoted as the fast track to the celestial kingdom.
It will be something to behold!
I rather think that it will be like Christian Science is today. - by Ex aedibus
Christian Science, much like Mormonism, does funny stuff with their statistics. For the longest time, they've refused to even admit just how many adherents they have. The most they will admit is how many congregations they have.
These have been shrinking, too. In some cities, there are perhaps a Second or a Third church still in existence with the First Church of Christ, Scientist long since sold off and closed.
I once substituted as an organist at a large Christian Science church in Salt Lake City. There could not have been more than twenty people there, counting myself. The First Church in Salt Lake, now closed, is a rather substantial building. Salt Lake City is hardly the only place to see such a precipitous decline in the practice of Christian Science.
That might be in the future of Mormonism. They might also have to figure out what to do with all of those empty temples. The best they could do, perhaps, is to somehow replace all the people who leave.
Quality of the membership - by Otremer
Best case, for the cult, is that it will maintain its gross numbers but there will be zero growth. As the cult dwindles as a percentage of the overall population, it will also dwindle in significance.
Quality of the membership in terms of intellect, income, and socio-economic status will continue to decline.
Then the reptilian shapeshifting Annunaki from Nibiru will return and the 'royalty' of the cult will reveal themselves as descendants from the Annunaki's last visit here.
When Mormonism takes over the world (delayed by a few years now that Mitt Romney is out United States presidential race), a number of sports teams will change names.
Green Bay Boyd Packers
San Francisco 47ers
St. Louis Sheeple
New Orleans Latter-day Saints
New England Patriarchs
The Cleveland Browns won't be allowed to play since they aren't white and delightsome enough.
Chicago White Shirts
Anaheim Angel Moronis
New York Mitts
San Diego Bishops
Los Angeles Deacons
The Cincinnati Reds will be allowed to play now that Ezra Taft Benson is gone.
Columbus Suit Jackets
St Louis Hymns ('cause we all know that is the only true music)
Canadian fans will be able to cheer for the Calgary Flaming Swords
Edmonton Consecrated Oilers and the Toronto Fig Leafs - whose uniforms will now include a green apron.
The New Jersey Devils will be cast out by the power of the Melchizedek Priesthood.
Golden State Stripling Warriors
Los Angeles Great Salt Lakers
In honor of the primary Portland will be shortened from Trailblazers to just Blazers and the Seattle Supersonics will become the Trekkers (especially after they move to Oklahoma).
And when everyone finally figures out the truth, the Chicago Bullshits
2006 - Gordo dies of old age. Monson takes over.
2007 - Monson dies of being unhealthy. Packer takes over.
2008 - Night of the long knives. All mormon leaders deemed a threat to Packer's power are quietly blood atoned during the night.
2008 - The "Danite Youth" program is started and all Aaronic Priesthood holders are required to take part in it. The Danite Youth indoctrinates the young men on the principles of Packerism.
2009 - Crystal Night - All non-mormon owned businesses in downtown Salt Lake are destroyed by Packer's Danite Youth.
2010 - Through plitical maneuvering, Packer becomes governor of Utah, and Mayor of Salt Lake City. The State Legislature is packed with Packer viceroys. Packer also takes control of the state Militia.
2011 - The State of Utah crosses into the Idaho border and annexes Idaho. The people of Idaho, mostly mormons, cheer the invading Utah forces. The governor of Idaho is relieved of his duties.
2011 - President Hillary Clinton issues an emergency White House meeting to discuss the growing Mormon problem.
2012 - Utah invades Montana, Arizona, Nevada, and Colorado on successive nights using Blitzkrieg tactics. The four states are annexed as part of Utah in less than a week.
2012 - The Democrats in congress want to stop Packer, using military force if necessary. The Republicand realize that Packer supporters are mostly republican, and are reluctant to confront him. The repuplican controlled congress vote to appease Packer.
2013. Packer invades the West Coast and New Mexico, turning the United States west of the Rockies into Utah, the largest and most powerful state in the Union. All library books in the new Utah are burned. Packer announces an approved reading list, The Book of Mormon, The Bible, D&C, PofGP, the Ensign, and The Work and the Glory series. All libraries are turned into mormon temples. R-rated movies are illegal in the new giant state of Utah.
2014. The new state of Utah has tremendous political power. Packer takes control of congress in mid-term elections through his power and influence. Congress votes to impeach President Clinton. She is convicted by the Packer Court. Congress replaces Clinton with Packer. Packer replaces all state governors with mormons. Names mormonism the official religion of the United States. Puts Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and himself on US Currency.
2015. The United States, under President Packer, invades Canada. Canada is defeated in less than six hours. US planes drop Book of Mormons on the defeated Canadian people.
2016 Packer sends planes to Europe to drop Book of Mormons. France shoots down one of the Book of Mormon planes. Packer declares war on France. Britain, Germany, and the rest of the Civilized world come to France's aid. WWIII has begun The US allies are Mexico, Guatemala, Chile, and the Phillipeans, all heavily mormon countries.
2017 The U.S. and her allies are defeated in a few months. Packer and his cronies commit suicide in his Salt Lake Bunker.
2018 The world returns to normal. Utah is divided into East Utah and West Utah. West Utah is controlled by Nevada and California. East Utah is controlled By New York and Washington DC. All mormon temples are blown up. Mormonism is declared illegal. All remaining mormons form a secret underground organization.
A future FPR (faith promoting rumor). It's the year 2031. One year ago, the Prophet finally told us that the time had come for the church to relocate to Missouri. Oil shortages many years ago had left us without motorized transport, so we had to walk.
Utah had become inhospitable for faithful Mormons due to a rapid influx of coffee drinkers and wine bibbers, as well as people who laughed at our sacred garments.
Many of the less-faithful saints chose the easy way out and fell away from the church. They claimed that they could not in good conscience believe in Mormonism and that any person with one-third or more of a brain could never believe the claims of Mormonism in this day and age, but we knew that they left because they were overcome with the desire to sinfully partake of coffee, wine and even sex, and that they wanted to wear worldly underwear.
Those who remained in the church were special beyond belief. They were more determined than ever to prove that they were worthy of Heavenly Father's special approbation.
When President Dickerhead, the newly annointed Prophet, Seer and Revelator, decreed that the faithful saints must now gather to Missouri, all 500 of the remaining saints unanimously sustained the decision. We called ourselves "the few who were chosen".
Some died on the long journey, but most of us made it. We gathered together for a special fast and testimony meeting to commemorate our arrival in "Zion of the Last Dispensation" where we were preparing to live communally on a plot of land in the very district that the Prophet Joseph Smith declared so long ago would be Zion.
Toward the close of the meeting, President Dickerhead whipped out a white hanky and twirled it above his head, shouting: "Hosanna to the Lord of Hosts! our protector, our healer, our guide!"
Just then there was a mighty rumble in the earth below and an enormous crevasse opened up and swallowed up every single one of the saints except for me and an old guy named LaVerne. They just completely disappeared without a trace, with the exception of the white hanky that had been twirled by President Dickerman. Immediately as President Dickerman fell into the crevasse, we had seen the saw white hanky fly upward in a violent gust of wind and then it fluttered down gently from the sky to land on LaVerne's head.
Needless to say, both LaVerne and I were dumbfounded.
LaVerne mumbled something about how he had sucked on a coffee-flavored candy earlier in the day because he was extremely hungry when he saw the partially sucked-on candy lying on the road on our way to Zion and couldn't resist the temptation to pick it up and pop it into his mouth.
LaVerne speculated that God must have taken the worthy saints up--or rather down, as it turned out--to be with him, and left us because we weren't worthy. He kept asking me what my sin was, but I didn't know.
I couldn't figure out why following the Prophet would have resulted in such a weird outcome. Certainly when Joseph Smith and Brigham Young were leading the church, they would never have given guidance that would have resulted in such a disaster as this! I had always thought that something about President Dickerman wasn't quite right. Maybe he was a fallen prophet!
Then it hit me. I had sinned. I had doubted the Prophet. LaVerne was right. Our sins had cut us off from the fellowship of the saints. His coffee candy and my doubts about Dickerman had cost us our reward in the Celestial Kingdom.
I wanted to write an letter to the Ensign and warn others not to doubt the Prophet. But I realized that there was no church on Earth and no Ensign to write to.
Then again, LaVerne is a priesthood holder, so maybe god wants him to be the new prophet and me to be the editor of the New Ensign....
I predict that the garments will change drastically within thirty years. They've gotten shorter and shorter, but you still can barely find a wedding dress that will cover them. I bet they'll eventually become no more than a tank top and boxers, and maybe even die out completely or be replaced by a ring or necklace or something. Let's face it. Garments suck big time. Even as a TBM (True Believing Mormon), I was not looking forward to the day that I would have to wear them. I guess I got out of that one! - 02/07/2004 - from MySongAngel
I recieved a revalation from Heavenly Father that the end of the world will be on a Sunday in December 2020. - 11/26/2003 - anon
Dead Pools are morbid games where people bet on who is going to die soon. Whoever gets the most right wins. How about a Mormon Doctrine Dead Pool? Which doctrines do you think will be dead soon? We've seen the Black/Cain doctrine officially die, the Polygamy doctrine (in this lifetime) officially die, the Adam/God doctrine unofficially die through denial, same with Blood Atonement. Which doctrines do think will die officially through some announcement (like the 1978 'revelation'), or unofficially by quietly discontinue the teaching of it and pretend it never happened?
I'll throw in
1) the female priesthood ban. I think this will end within 20 years.
2) BofM as historical fact. The church can never completely deny the BofM, but with DNA evidence destroying it they will have to find some medium between it being a divine translation yet fictional. It will be interesting to see what the PR geniuses come up with.
3) The BofA facsimile's will quietly disappear in the next set of scriptures. Without the facsimilie's, you can't connect the Book of Abraham to the Papyri found in 1967. Just take out the pictures and pretend they never existed, end of controversy. If someone pulls out an old set of scriptures with the facsimiles, just say that was never official doctrine.
4) The Temple Ceremony will be changed again within 10 years. Still too much weird masonry stuff.
...they've already stopped teaching that God was once man, and man may become God in them. ;)
...I would put them in the exact opposite order. I don't see the women holding the priesthood within the next 20 years. The "brethren" won't give up on that one so easily.
I'd also add a "revelatory addendum" to the Word of Wisdom within 25 years clarifying the church's position on caffeine and a glass of wine with dinner.
Missionaries will not serve for two years. They'll be sent on one year missions and told to marry and have kids immediately when home.
Foreign countries will not welcome single missionaries so the church will encourage married young couples to go on missions (with their children)
I currently live and work overseas, strangely enough in the same country where I served a mission about 17 years ago.
At the time we had nearly nine hundred missionaries in the country. Today it's around 600, with zero prospects of an increase anytime soon,and membership numbers are stagnating.
I believe your idea of one-year missions is apprpopriate, but has already been in practice for quite some time in some foreign countries.
The American elders here all serve two years, but the local elders almost never serve more than one. A one year mission followed by an honorable release certificate and a leadership calling in their home ward. They are supposed to go home, get married, and become priesthood leaders to strengthen their branches and wards.
And yet the church still isn't growing much over here, and most local members still don't serve missions despite cutting the times in half.
Maybe they should cut them down to six or nine months and see what happens.
The Mormon church will eventually permit non-member relatives attend weddings in the temple. I think this is really causing a lot of people a lot of heartburn. There is really no reason not to let it happen other than perhaps letting them witness the "patriarchal grip". The funny clothes might be a real shocker, but I think non-mos could be prepared for that one.
I'm not so sure the Morg would relent as easily for members who were once card carriers but no longer believed. I think they would prefer to still let us "suffer" outside.
(1) the following scriptural verses will be deleted:
1 John 4:7-8
1 Corinthians 13 [entire chapter]
I Thessalonians 4:9
The text corresponding to these may be left blank/empty (a la the Jehovah Witnesses' old green dragon), *OR* they may get replaced with stern, simplistic platitudes about unquestioning loyalty. I've got 5:4 odds on the latter.
(2) The official title of Packer's mantle will be renamed: 'Prophet, Seer, Revelator, and Grand Imperial Wizard'
(3) BYU's Motto (and the corresponding D&C 93:36) will be changed to "The Glory of God is Lockstep Obedience"
(4) Seminary and Institute Teachers will have to be re-certified every summer at a 9-week intensive bootcamp at a secret compound in Provo Canyon surrounded by high concrete fences topped with rolled razor-wire; this bootcamp, incorporating "wear them down" techniques, will culminate in an inspirational, tear-inducing, swearing of fealty ceremony that will revive the gory self-execution penalties that were removed from the temple ceremony in 1990. [Boyd's favorite part -he's still pissed that they were taken out!]
(5a) The official sustaining of General Authorities in conferences (ward / stake / regional / general) will be modified; the show of hands will only be valid with fingers tightly together, elbow straight, and angled slightly forward toward the podium from the shoulder. On a related note (5b) the temple ceremony will have the word "Heil" (or perhaps "Sieg Heil") worked into it at least 4 places.
1. The whole temple idea. I think temples will be used for something other than a secrect ritual. Hinkmiester already started that one by denying the god once a man thing.
2. The whole prophet on the earth today. When was the last time a "prophet" had any kind of prophecy? The will keep the idea of Apostles for the sake of tradition, but abondon the idea that these guys are talking to god.
3. Slowly the church will start to publicly disclaim all the urban legands out there. The end times ones for sure.
All this will be the LDS inc look a lot more like the Southern Baptists.
If they have any hopes of keeping young women interested in marring Joe Mormon they'll have to get rid of the whole multiple wives after death stuff. These young girls today are having nothing to do with that. And they know they don't "need" a man, the joy is in "wanting" a man to share time and eternity with.
I think the whole view on men and women will have to change if they hope to keep things going for very long. Not long ago I was at a young aduld function; the way these college age girls were talking the did not seek the same kind of guy that the church thinks they sould seek. A lot of talk about finishing college, and making fun a these RMs who go on for hours about their missions.
In general LDS inc will need to gain REAL respect for women instead of simply telling them how important they are.
OK, here is my list (a little tongue in cheek).
1. Bikini cut garments.
2. Meetings cut down to 1 hour blocks, with readers digest condensed lessons.
3. We have no recollection of doing those things in the temple.
4. After praying and arguing with God many long hours, homosexuals will be allowed temple marriage (this one I really believe will happen, but not until social pressure climbs about 10 fold from now).
5. Testimony meetings will be changed to have the Bishop or designate read affidavit like testimonials (there goes the crying and the embarrassing diatribes).
6. DNA evidence will be accepted, and the brethren will categorically deny that the BOM was meant to take literally. They will use Paul H. Dunn as their spin doctor for this.
7. Beer and wine and caffeinated drinks will be allowed. Not by revelation, but they will simply quit asking the questions on the temple recommend (don't ask don't tell).
"The following are some excerpts from 'The Reconstruction of Mormon Doctrine: From Joseph Smith to Progressive Theology' by Thomas G. Alexander which appeared in Sunstone, July-August 1980. Alexander teaches at BYU. His thoughts tie in well with my essay on the changing nature of God in LDS doctrine."
He's been dead since 1998. As far as I can tell, he is still dead.
Wherefore my servant Joseph did translate even with my power and authority a portion of the gold plates delivered unto his hand by my servant Moroni, as a witness of the workings of my people upon the promised land, and as warning unto the world that they may learn and walk in righteousness before me. And I have heard the prayers and pleadings from the righteous who desire to know of me, and who rejoice in the revealed words of my humble prophets. For truly the time has come when the prayers of these righteous souls shall be answered and the hitherto sealed portions of the gold plates shall be revealed unto the world.
Let those that have eyes see and those that have ears hear and those that have the spirit of discernment understand the greatest truth that I can reveal unto the world. Even as I created the heavens and the earth did I create a similitude of the Father and his only begotten son for all to plainly see. And I did cause the moon to be given unto the earth. And just as the son doth glorify the father and the father the son so doth the earth glorify the moon and the moon the earth.
And now I will have mercy upon creation and reveal truth unto men, that they may praise the name of the father forever. Even before the fish of the sea and the birds of the air were created did we open up the heavens from past earths and celestial glories already attained and the cows thereof did supply such quantities of milk as are beyond the ability of the world to fathom. And this was then made into the most exquisite and precious and beautiful green cheese, beyond the ability to imagine. Wherefore I caused this green cheese to be fashioned into the moon. And to protect the moon did I cause a rock layer to be strewn over the entire surface. And only at the end of the fullness of the dispensation of times will I cause the rock layer to be removed, that the world may witness the full glory of this creation, and rejoice in my name.
And let my servants now proclaim unto the ends of the earth that the moon is made of the most exquisite and precious and beautiful green cheese. And let the hard-hearted and godless souls who have hitherto rejected the message of the restored gospel be warned that whosoever rejecteth the plain and simple truth of the moon being made of the most exquisite and precious and beautiful green cheese shall be utterly destroyed. And for those that reject this most sacred truth, there shall be no redemption in this life or the next, for this sin is too great that my blood might cover it.
And now I reveal unto you, my faithful servants, line upon line and precept upon precept, where ye may seek the sealed gold plates. And I did cause Moroni to place them in the thin rock layer that doth cover the exquisite and precious and beautiful green cheese that is the moon.
Wherefore let three apostles be called and appointed and anointed for the sacred mission to retrieve the gold plates. And let the salt flats of Deseret, which I prepared for this purpose even before Adam was created, be used for the construction of ships after the manner of that which the world hath already built for the great expanse of space. And my servants, even the three appointed apostles of my restored Church, will cross the sea of space and land in the middle of the visible part of the moon from earth. And I will then cause my servant Moroni to show unto my servants the apostles the gold plates, and the seal thereupon shall be loosened, and the most sacred and precious things shall be revealed unto you that I would have blessed the Nephites.
For now I speak great truths unto you that I verily caused the Nephites to build ships, and I did instruct them carefully as to the craftsmanship thereof, to take them into the heavens, even unto the moon. And I revealed unto them the most sacred truth of the moon being made of the most exquisite and precious and beautiful green cheese, and I did cause for one night the rocky layer to be removed so that they could glory in the utmost beauty and grandeur of my creation and praise my name forever.
But behold the Nephites did fall into all manner of wickedness and did reject my words and my prophets so that I withdrew this truth and knowledge from them. And on the ships their Liahonas did fail them because of the wickedness in their souls and the ships did become lost on that greatest ocean of all and the inhabitants did bitterly perish.
And therefor attend wisely unto the accomplishment of these things, with righteousness in your hearts and an eye single to the glory of God. For if ye will walk in righteousness before me and verily purify my Church, then ye shall inherit Eternal life and exaltation. And even as I shall establish my Church upon the moon and later upon Mars, so shall ye in your perfected state travel unto galaxies and stars beyond your imaginations, even unto Kolob and beyond.
Now go forth and accomplish my glory. Even so. Amen
Fruitful bough, supposedly prophesying Lehi's crossing of the ocean - Genesis 49:22 - Joseph [is] a fruitful bough, [even] a fruitful bough by a well; [whose] branches run over the wall:
Two sticks, supposedly prophesying the combining of the Bible and the Book of Mormon - Ezekiel 37:16 ff - Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and [for] all the house of Israel his companions: 17 And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand. ... 21 ... Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land...
Other Sheep, supposedly prophesying Jesus' visit to the Nephites - John 10:16 - And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, [and] one shepherd.
Familiar spirit out of the ground, supposedly prophesying the Gold Plates being retrieved from their burial place in the Hill Cumorah - Isaiah 29:4 And thou shalt be brought down, [and] shalt speak out of the ground, and thy speech shall be low out of the dust, and thy voice shall be, as of one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust.
Side comment: Mormons don't mention that the word for "familiar spirit" is Hebrew 'ob,' occuring about fifteen times in the Bible. It does NOT mean "a spirit which sounds familiar to you (because it is written in the style of the King James Bible), as most Mormons think, but it means the spirit of a dead person, that is, the necromantic summoning of a ghost, which is everywhere condemned in the Bible as abominable (e.g. Deuteronomy 18:10-12).
Send Elijah, a prophecy of Elijah's role in the modern restoration (e.g. D&C 110:13) - Malachi 4:5-6 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: 6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
Side comment: Mormons overlook the fact that this prophecy was already fulfilled in John the Baptist (Matt 11:14, Mark 9:11, Luke 1:17).
Sealed book, a prophecy of Professor Anthon's conversation with Martin Harris - Isaiah 29:11-14 And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which [men] deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it [is] sealed: 12 And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I am not learned.
There are others, of course. How did the Mormons come to find such passages, and to interpret them as prophecies in support of Mormonism? It's really quite simple. It's a technique that was developed by Jewish scholars in the last centuries before the common era, and used to great advantage by New Testament writers, especially the author of the Gospel of Matthew. You simply scour the older, authoritative writings, for some favorable phrase or sentence that might apply to what you would like to believe was "prophesied," and - I guarantee it - you will find much material.
Personally, I do not believe in divine prophecy. But I can apply the technique, and can find prophecies aplenty.
If Mormons pull the prophecy ploy on you, then, you might reply in kind:
Psalms 3:7 - Arise, O LORD; save me, O my God: for thou hast smitten all mine enemies [upon] the cheek bone; thou hast broken the teeth of the ungodly.
Psalms 58:6 - Break their teeth, O God, in their mouth: break out the great teeth of the young lions, O LORD.
Proverbs 25:19 - Confidence in an unfaithful man in time of trouble [is like] a broken tooth, and a foot out of joint.
JS denied continually that the Mormons were practicing plural marriage; he insisted he had only one wife, as late as 1844: "What a thing it is for a man to be accused of committing adultery, and having seven wives, when I can only find one. I am the same man, and as innocent as I was fourteen years ago; and I can prove them all perjurers." (HoC 6:411) This lying was prophesied over 2000 years before!:
Jeremiah 48:10 - Cursed [be] he that doeth the work of the LORD deceitfully,... (Compare D&C 50:17-18: Verily I say unto you, he that is ordained of me and sent forth to preach the word of truth by the Comforter, in the Spirit of truth, doth he preach it by the Spirit of truth or some other way? 18 And if it be by some other way it is not of God.)
Revelation 2:2 - I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars...
Revelation 2:4 is a prophecy of Joseph Smith's unfaithfulness to his wife Emma: Nevertheless I have [somewhat] against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.
Revelation 21:8 prophesies Smith's adulteries, his dabbling in magic, and his lying:
8 But the ... whoremongers, and sorcerers, ... and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Jeremiah 29:21-23 prophesies his adulteries with his friends' wives while pretending to be a prophet - 21 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel, of [false prophets]... 23 Because they have committed villany in Israel, and have committed adultery with their neighbours' wives, and have spoken lying words in my name, which I have not commanded them; even I know, and [am] a witness, saith the LORD.
Even modern prophecy condemns Smith's sins (this is a useful quote when Mormons ask us to overlook Smith's little "mistakes"):
D&C 50:26-28 (speaking of the president of the church): He that is ordained of God and sent forth, the same is appointed to be the greatest, notwithstanding he is the least and the servant of all. 27 Wherefore, he is possessor of all things; for all things are subject unto him, both in heaven and on the earth, the life and the light, the Spirit and the power, sent forth by the will of the Father through Jesus Christ, his Son. 28 But no man is possessor of all things except he be purified and cleansed from all sin.
Joseph Smith was not a humble man, but rather boasted of his achievements. One of his most famous boasts, made May 26, 1844, shortly before his death, is in the History of the Church 6:408-409:
"Come on! ye prosecutors! ye false swearers! All hell, boil over! Ye burning mountains, roll down your lava! for I will come out on the top at last. I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days [p.409] of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet."
Smith was not aware, apparently, of the Biblical prophetic warnings:
Proverbs 27:1-2 - Boast not thyself of to morrow; for thou knowest not what a day may bring forth. 2 Let another man praise thee, and not thine own mouth; a stranger, and not thine own lips.
Proverbs 26:12 - Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? [there is] more hope of a fool than of him.
Isaiah 10:15 - Shall the axe boast itself against him that heweth therewith? [or] shall the saw magnify itself against him that shaketh it?
Even his own prophecies warned him: D&C 3:4 - For although a man may have many revelations, and have power to do many mighty works, yet if he boasts in his own strength, and sets at naught the counsels of God, and follows after the dictates of his own will and carnal desires, he must fall and incur the vengeance of a just God upon him.
This is one of the few prophecies of Joseph Smith which was quickly fulfilled, since he was killed barely one month after making his public boast.
Joseph Smith's false prophecies were also prophesied of in the Bible. (Almost none of his prophecies were fulfilled; see a listing at JOSEPH SMITH AS A PROPHET.)
Deuteronomy 18:20-22 - But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die. 21 And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? 22 When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that [is] the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, [but] the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.
Jeremiah 5:31 - The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love [to have it] so...
Jeremiah 23:16 - Thus saith the LORD of hosts, Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart, [and] not out of the mouth of the LORD.
Jeremiah 14:14 - Then the LORD said unto me, The prophets prophesy lies in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart.
Side comment: Note that this was said at the time Lehi was a "prophet" in Jerusalem.
Matthew 24:11 - And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Matthew 24:24 - For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if [it were] possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Joseph Smith claimed that he was ministered to by three personages claiming to be Peter, James and John. This event was also prophesied in the Bible:
Revelation 16:13 - And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs [come] out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Q: And this belief in contemporary revelation and prophecy? As the prophet, tell us how that works. How do you receive divine revelation? What does it feel like?
A: Let me say first that we have a great body of revelation, the vast majority of which came from the prophet Joseph Smith. We don't need much revelation. We need to pay more attention to the revelation we've already received.
This situation was also prophesied over 2000 years ago!:
2 Nephi 28:27-30 - Yea, wo be unto him that saith: We have received, and we need no more! ... 29 Wo be unto him that shall say: We have received the word of God, and we need no more of the word of God, for we have enough! 30 For behold, thus saith the Lord God: ... for unto him that receiveth I will give more; and from them that shall say, We have enough, from them shall be taken away even that which they have.
Micah 3:5-11 - Thus saith the LORD concerning the prophets that make my people err, ... 6 Therefore night [shall be] unto you, that ye shall not have a vision; and it shall be dark unto you, that ye shall not divine; and the sun shall go down over the prophets, and the day shall be dark over them. 7 Then shall the seers be ashamed, and the diviners confounded: yea, they shall all cover their lips; for [there is] no answer of God. ... 11 The heads thereof judge for reward, and the priests thereof teach for hire, and the prophets thereof divine for money: yet will they lean upon the LORD, and say, [Is] not the LORD among us? none evil can come upon us.
The LDS church has employed a public relations firm to promote its image, and is trying to appeal to a broader Christian audience. It is obvious that Hinckley's purpose is to make the church more popular, more acceptable. This was also prophesied:
1 Nephi 22:23 For the time speedily shall come that all churches which ... are built up to become popular in the eyes of the world, and those who seek the lusts of the flesh and the things of the world, and to do all manner of iniquity; yea, in fine, all those who belong to the kingdom of the devil are they who need fear, and tremble, and quake; they are those who must be brought low in the dust; they are those who must be consumed as stubble; and this is according to the words of the prophet.
The LDS church has just completed it new conference hall, seating 21,000. This building was also prophesied:
1 Nephi 8:26-33 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the other side of the river of water, a great and spacious building; and it stood as it were in the air, high above the earth. 27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the attitude of mocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit. ... 31 And he also saw other multitudes feeling their way towards that great and spacious building. ... 33 And great was the multitude that did enter into that strange building. And after they did enter into that building they did point the finger of scorn at me and those that were partaking of the fruit also; but we heeded them not.
Hinckley has boasted that: 1) many temples are being built; half a dozen per year are being dedicated. The Medford temple (typical) cost $3.5 million. Based on those figures, one can estimate $21 million per year is spent on temple construction. 2) the LDS church donated, over a ten-year period, $150 million to charitable purposes, i.e. $15 million per year. This situation was also prophesied:
Mormon 8:37 For behold, ye do love money, and your substance, and your fine apparel, and the adorning of your churches, more than ye love the poor and the needy, the sick and the afflicted.
2 Nephi 28:13 They rob the poor because of their fine sanctuaries; they rob the poor because of their fine clothing; and they persecute the meek and the poor in heart, because in their pride they are puffed up.
Hinckley's general message to the church and to the world is: The church is prospering! This was also prophesied:
2 Nephi 28:21 And others will he [the devil] pacify, and lull them away into carnal security, that they will say: All is well in Zion; yea, Zion prospereth, all is well--and thus the devil cheateth their souls, and leadeth them away carefully down to hell.
To get a temple recommend one must pay a full tithe. As part of the temple ceremony, one is "washed clean from the blood and sins of this generation." This was also prophesied:
Mormon 8:32 Yea, it shall come in a day when there shall be churches built up that shall say: Come unto me, and for your money you shall be forgiven of your sins.
The modern LDS testimony meeting follows a pattern which has become traditional in the church. Those who wish to speak ("bear testimony") go to the pulpit, which is usually raised above the level of the audience, and which is called "the stand" in a Mormon chapel. They there say whatever the spirit moves them to say; however, it almost always includes the same rote statements: "I know the Gospel is true; I know that the Book of Mormon is true; I know that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God; I know that Gordon B. Hinckley [or whoever the current prophet may be] is a prophet of God; I am grateful that I have been blessed to be born in this day and age when the Gospel has been restored..." This phenomenon was accurately described (and condemned) in prophecy:
Alma 31:13 - For they had a place built up in the center of their synagogue, a place for standing, which was high above the head; and the top thereof would only admit one person. 14 Therefore, whosoever desired to worship must go forth and stand upon the top thereof, and stretch forth his hands towards heaven, and cry with a loud voice, saying: 15 Holy, holy God; we believe that thou art God, ... we believe that thou hast elected us to be thy holy children; ... 17 But thou art the same yesterday, today, and forever; and thou hast elected us that we shall be saved, whilst all around us are elected to be cast by thy wrath down to hell; for the which holiness, O God, we thank thee; and we also thank thee that thou hast elected us, ... 18 And again we thank thee, O God, that we are a chosen and a holy people. Amen.... 20 For behold, every man did go forth and offer up these same prayers. 21 Now the place was called by them Rameumptom, which, being interpreted, is the holy stand. 22 Now, from this stand they did offer up, every man, the selfsame prayer unto God, thanking their God that they were chosen of him, ...
When Gordon B. Hinckley was de facto head of the church, he was unable to detect the forgeries of Mark Hofmann. He was also unable to translate the papyrii given to the church in 1966 from which JS produced the Book of Abraham. If he were really a prophet, that should not have been the case:
Mosiah 8:17 - But a seer can know of things which are past, and also of things which are to come, and by them shall all things be revealed, or, rather, shall secret things be made manifest, and hidden things shall come to light, and things which are not known shall be made known by them, and also things shall be made known by them which otherwise could not be known.
Moroni 10:5 - And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things.
Amos 3:7 - Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.
D&C 107:91-92 - And again, the duty of the President of the office of the High Priesthood is to preside over the whole church, and to be like unto Moses-- 92 Behold, here is wisdom; yea, to be a seer, a revelator, a translator, and a prophet, having all the gifts of God which he bestows upon the head of the church.
Even the fact that the Mormon false prophets will be uncovered and exposed by people living in Utah was prophesied. Notice that in this prophecy, it is not the leaders of the people who will expose the frauds, but "the inhabitants" (e.g., the Tanners, who are "inhabitants" of Utah [Zion]):
D&C 64:38-39 - For it shall come to pass that the inhabitants of Zion shall judge all things pertaining to Zion. 39 And liars and hypocrites shall be proved by them, and they who are not apostles and prophets shall be known.
The vicissitudes and tribulation of the modern church were also foreseen in prophecy, and these prophecies indicate that the modern church is not in God's good favor:
Deuteronomy 29:28 prophesied the moves from Kirtland to Missouri to Illinois to Utah:
28 And the LORD rooted them out of their land in anger, and in wrath, and in great indignation, and cast them into another land, as [it is] this day.
And the 1847 move to the Great Salt Lake Valley, an uninhabited desert, was clearly prophesied (I think this is my FAVORITE Biblical prophecy!):
Jeremiah 17:5-6 - Thus saith the LORD; Cursed [be] the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD. 6 For he shall be like the heath in the desert, and shall not see when good cometh; but shall inhabit the parched places in the wilderness, [in] a salt land and not inhabited.
I hope that these notes will help you to counter Mormon claims that Mormonism is true "because it was prophesied"!
And I hope you can do it without being as obviously tongue-in-cheek as I am.
(Try "finding prophecies" yourself! It's great fun, especially in places like Aesop, Grimm's Fairy Tales, Mother Goose...)
- 05/27/2000 - Richard in Oregon
05/25/2000 - anon
Wasn't He at General Conference?
12/21/1999 - Mac
When the Elders of Neek receive their Shrubbery's
12/12/1999 - anon
Are there Marriot's in the Terrestial Kingdom? Should I be making reservations now?
12/10/1999 - Bummer Dude
Joseph Smith I admit, may have had one "revelation" that actually came true (sort of). 1) He said that things should be wrapped up when he was 85. (1890)
2) Brigham Young said the everlasting truth was that, unless a man engaged in "The Principle", (polygamy), he could not enter the Celestial Kingdom
3) Brigham's successor genuflected to the U.S. government and declared that no longer would polygamous marriages (on earth) be valid, in 1890. Brigham made no such distinction.
Conclusion: A male must have engaged in Church-santioned plural marriage to be elgible for the CK. Yet the church doesnt authorize such marriages. Result=The Terrestial Kingdom is going to be a lot more crowded than TBM's think!
12/06/1999 - Mr. Toad
Ezra Taft Benson
"His Church has been reestablished among men with all the spiritual gifts enjoyed anciently. All this is done in preparation for Christ's second coming. The great and dreadful day of the Lord is near at hand. In preparation for this great event and as a means of escaping the impending judgments, inspired messengers have gone forth to the nations of the earth carrying this testimony and warning.
This great time is drawing near. There is every evidence that His second coming is near at hand.... Not many years hence Christ will come again.
("Joy in Christ," Ensign 16 [March 1986]: 5.)
Note - of course with such fuzzy phrases like "not many years" and "time is drawing near" and "near at hand" completely sidesteps the question of when. What is meant by "not many"?
For comparison, Elder Joseph B. Wirthlin said in the Oct '98 General Conference, Perhaps in an effort to escape the challenges of our times, a few voices proclaim that the Second Coming of the Savior is imminent. Perhaps, but the Lord could not have been more plain when He said of His triumphal return to the earth, "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."
Ok, what gives - Benson's "real soon now" vs Wirthlin's "no one knows".
Q: How can one know "real soon" without knowing when?
A: They can't!
Bottom line: Theological nonsense to keep the masses in line. Mr Toad 12/02/1999
When will Marie Osmond name her "Mystery Abuser"?
When will Gladys Knight cajole her new husband into a "Temple Marriage"
When will Steve Young, LDS pro football player marry?
After proposing and backing out twice, Young finally married 03/14/2000 in Hawaii to Barbara Graham.
When will CNN pundit, Larry King who is married to Shawn, a Mormon, join the LDS Church?
When will the first non-Caucasian male be ordained an apostle?
When will Orrin Hatch, Senator from Utah become President of the USA?
When will you be able to purchase Sunstone Magazine at Deseret Book?
When will the Smithsonian accept the Book of Mormon as a genuine ancient indigenous record?
When will the Corporation of the President pay royalty fees and copyright infringement fines to the American Freemason Society?
When will BYU have a female president?
When will Cleon Skousen stop believing in conspiracies?
When will lady missionaries be called at age nineteen?
When will a President of the LDS Church be called while under usual and normal retirement age?
When will the constitution of the United States hang by a used piece of dental floss?
When will Gerald and Sandra Tanner be bestowed an honorary chair at the LDS History Department?
When will Boyd K Packer and D Michael Quinn kiss and make up?
When will Marie Osmond and Gladys Knight be called to Relief Society General Presidency?
When will the polygamy question stop haunting the LDS Church?
This weekend at the General Conference/Self-agrandisement Mumble Fest,
I predict the church accountant will issue an exact dollar and cents report of income and expenses for the fiscal year. Eh, maybe not.
I predict Gordy and the 12 will come clean and confess that they really are just maintaining the corporation for money and power. Eh, maybe not.
I predict that Gordy will promote a new quad combo scripture edition that lists the original text and the changed text in side-by-side columns, with false prophecies of Joseph Smith highlighted in red. Ehhh......maybe not.
I predict that the GA's will not use the words humble, blessed, glorious or wondrous one time the whole weekend. Eh.......maybe not.
I predict that the GA's will each show up wearing a suit distinctively different in color and style from the others. Uh uh.
I predict that Gordy will follow suit with the leader of the Worldwide Church of God, the Armstrong church, who stood in front of his people and confessed that they had been teaching a false gospel and henceforth would preach the gospel as taught in the New Testament. I predict that Gordy will do the same. Or maybe not.
I was walking along out in Adams homeland (the place now know as Missouri) and I happened to stumble (quite literally) a box protruding from the earth. We have been blessed with some wholesome precipitation witch brought forth this marvelous relic. It is the Platinum plates of Previous Precious Profits. The inscriptions upon the plates were never before seen to me.
Being one of little knowledge, I traveled to a place of great wealth and knowledge (Namely Walmart) and procured an sacred object to aid in my translation of said plates. The object was round, yellow, and had a long string attached to it. It was revealed to me that this object is the Mithum (even though it is known to modern heretics as a Yo yo).
However, to truly translate the plates with accuracy, a Rumum needed to be obtained. The wonderful spirit of enlightenment lead me to the nurishment section, wherein I was prompted to procure a rectangular box with an angel wearing clothes unlike any I have ever worn on the front. Inside this wonderful container of nutrients, I came upon the blessed Rumum. This Rumum was like unto what the unblessed would term a "Secret Decoder Ring."
Having been blessed with these precious relics, I did, therefore commense to translate these plates. It was revealed to me that the inscriptions on these precious plates were of Reformed Pig-Latin. Working diligently throughout the nights and days following the discovery of the said plates, I translated the first portion. Unfortunately, I allowed my former aid to take the translations completed out of my study. They were then lost. Because of this carelessness, it has been deemed that we are not prepared for the information in that portion. (So as no one can try to use the information to doubt my word.)
It has been revealed to me that Adam was not a true person at all. He was in fact what we now have decided to name a T-Rex. He did in fact have multiple wives (who in turn have multiple husbands) and often engaged in such practices that are similar to those now in practice at the white house with Interns. I have also found that William Jefferson Clinton has also been inspired of the same information.
According to the plates only those who practice all forms of fornication, drink all types of alcoholic beverages, and smoke (at least once) some form of tobacco can be saved. Salvation also requires monetary commitment (9% of your income). However, with your down payment on salvation (a low one time $24.99), you can recieve a free set of Ginsu steak knives--also part of the holy relic.
It has also been revealed to me that the second coming will occur at the true Garden of Eden which is now known as glorious and wealthy Manhattan.
Translations of the Precious Platinum Plates of Previous Profits can be obtained through any followers of the one True Church, The Church of Much Money.
Half way to your 25 year prediction and you couldn't be any farther off the beaten path. The temples are fulfilling many of Isiah's prophetic scripture. Any intellect who has studied the lds religion and the gospel of Jesus Christ as set apart in the new testament would be a fool to ignore the signs of the times, and the truthfulness of the words of latter-day prophets and apostles. All people of christian faith who know the savior know what he stood for and Jesus Christ has standards and went around doing good to all people. Those who know the standards of the lds church know they are just, true and predicated on principles of righteousness. They also know of our well fare system and no other organization on earth save the red cross has done more to help humanity, provide food and shelter to the homeless and hungry not to mention cloth the naked than The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. "be ye wise" and judge not the things of God. - 11/18/2012 - ToDHedley
Hey folks...! The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Saints is stalling and slowing down...? Guess what. We reached more than 14,000,000 membership just last year. How do you spell W-I-S-H-F-U-L T-H-I-N-K-I-N-G...? - 03/13/2012 - numbers numb nut
I laughed all the way through this by the way Monson is still alive though you said he would already be dead. - 02/12/2012 - member
I just read your first paragraph in this page and disagree.
The church as the bride is preparing for the second coming of Christ, which from my perspective is nigh around the corner.
For those that do not understand this, they are getting swept up in the world and selling their birthright as descendants of Ephraim as Esau or Reuben of old did. They are the ones degrading the church and its purposes in ushering in the second coming.
For those that understand the second coming of Christ is eminent, they are preparing for this event, whether moving to Utah or other gathering places. Read the Book of Mormon with the view that it pertains to us, America and the church today. It is a record of a people looking forward to the coming of a resurrected Messiah, like we are. President Wilford Woodruff indicated that if you want to know the signs of the times when Christ will come, read the 9th, 10th and 11th chapters of 3rd Nephi. President Ezra Taft Benson indicated that the book for several decades before that parallels today and he stated "the Book of Mormon was written for us today." Like the Nephites of old, we too, are or should be looking forward to the coming of a resurrected Messiah, in this case a Millennial Messiah. The signs are there for those who are watching...even those leaving the church as you indicate in droves are a sign of the times.
Good luck in your endeavors, I may post more in the future. (Editor's Note: God Almighty I hope no more posts from this clueless person who writes a serious reply to a parody web site. Jesus can have you!) - 11/19/2010 - ADiscipleofChrist
The Scientology religion was founded by a science-fiction dreamer. Another dreamer founded the Mormon religion. He was Joe Smith, and he dreamed of an American religion. So he made it to be true; he wrote his own scripture (the book of mormon)and even rewrote the Bible. He decided that some Old Testament Jews went by submarines to America (this is not, they claim, science fiction). All rubbish. There is no proof for the Mormon religion's claims to being part of the ancient history of the Americas. There is no history of ancient Israelites in America; certainly not writing in "reformed egyptian". It is all another huge, science- fiction fraud. The web, maybe, will help to destroy this cult. - 08/19/2010 - daoud
This is bunk, there are 12 million members and growing. The doctrine has never changed since I've been a member and it never will, because God's word does not change. It is never an embarrassment to any member only those who feel they know they truth, as they see it. How sad that you are so fogged up with lies. In my search for God I find it everyday in my religion, in my prayers and in my heart. Only a man with no sure knowledge of something would say these things. It is beyond me how anyone can feel this way, but then again it is beyond me how people can think that socialism and gov't control is the answer in the US. We are losing what freedoms we had because of of complacency and godless people. - 04/28/2010 - Betty1
This is such alot of misinformation...how sad. - 04/07/2010 - anon
You could be more convincing. The angel Moroni told Joseph Smith that people like you would speak evil of him, and all you have done is fulfill Joseph Smith's first prediction!
The problem with your post is that you do not understand the mystery of the menorah, Joseph was the six light of the menorah, but out of the seven seers, or lights of Truth, only sixth light is evil spoken of according to Joseph Smith.
You do help to propagate that teaching of Joseph by speaking evil of him. The way to make Joseph into a liar would be to only speak well of him. You don't have to say he was the Truth, but you could say, that I see him like all the other prophets of the Bible, and that the Bible is a book for the weak minded who want to believe there is a God. That way you would not be speaking "evil" of him, but you would be voicing your opinion about him being a phony, because you do not believe in a personal God.
Albert Einstein understood that concept about God, therefore he refused to believe in a personal God that spoke to prophets, but you're no Einstein. Einstein believed in dreams, most of his mathematical solution to problems came to him through dreams.
My friend John Tusson worked with Albert Einstein, and he knew this. The problem I have with Einstein's concept of God, and your approach to the same problem is who the one that sparks the dream in man? When you have dreams, and when Einstein had dreams, and when Joseph Smith had dreams, what was the cause of cause that spark dream?
You can say that you never had a dream, but that would not answer where Einstein's dream came from. There is no doubt in my mind that Einstein had dreams, but even Einstein failed to explain where that dream came from. Now, Joseph Smith had the courage to say that God sparked his dreams. And it doesn't take another Einstein to figure out that a small spark in itself is not perfect. All that it means is that it was a catalyst to something more. Something to build upon, even Jesus taught that principle to the ancient church, for he said to St. Peter, thou art the ROCK that I will establish my kingdom upon.
Even Joseph Smith understood that principle of truth that he was only building upon what St. Peter have established.
There is no teaching given by Joseph Smith that said that he completed to build the kingdom of God. He sought to establish the kingdom of heaven, and that was what led to his death when he ordered the destruction of the press that was publishing and revealing the kingdom of heaven that Joseph was working to establish, that led to his arrest and eventual death as a martyr.
Had he succeed in his plans to establish the kingdom of heaven, he would have been the first in history to have fully established the kingdom upon this earth. However, the prophet Zechariah predicted that only "The BRANCH" will succeed in establishing the kingdom upon this earth. And it will take 144,000 newly appointed gods to march with him.
You're being unfair with Joseph Smith, he never had a change to organize the 144,000, but what will you then say about "The BRANCH" when he lands upon Jerusalem with his 144,000 newly appointed gods mounted upon flying horses in June 2012? Well you then say, I am against it, and it matter not that they do as they take over Jerusalem and fulfill Joseph Smith's dream? - 12/09/2008 - Mo-dreamer
Haha wow, someone was a little off... I still don't understand why so many ppl are anti-mormonism? I'm not mormon but I have respect for their religion, and all religions for that matter. Haha.. take over the world? Are you serious? This is why what you said didn't happen. Have some respect bro. - 12/01/2008 - Danny
I read the 'prophecy' and had a very good laugh !!! You should be a comedian ... ;o)
I am a former Mormon, still living in Utah. I doubt though that Utah will become so powerful, but it was a good story... ha ha ha... ;o) - 04/21/2008 - Alan
First of all President Hinckley died in a month ago in 2008, President Monson just became president and is still alive, and third of all 2012 is the end of days.... your predictions are all wrong you are wrong wrong i tell you - 03/10/2008 - maddude
I predict that the world will end on 25 December 2012, the coming of Christ has a lot more to do with the revealing of technology than it has to do with religion. Technology will eventually reveal that all mystical religions are based on misconceptions of what God is. The truth that is to be revealed is scientific in nature and is in part already revealed. The resurection has a scientific base. Christ's life and death is the joining of the the dying DNA of Adam with the living DNA of heaven, Christss body being part man, part God ... a joining link. We will soon see that we are like God , created in His image, He shall walk among us and teach as one man to another. Knowledge is basic to salvation. - 05/01/2005 - born again Carl Sagan
I prophecy that so long as Mormons lure people into their cult, those of us that saw our way out of the web will continue to poke fun at the event! - 04/12/2003 - anon
It will be,and it came to pass, that the prophet and stuff will finish the translation of the inspired version of the bible and publish it as demanded by D and C; that he will finish the translation of the book of abraham, and the whole of the book of joseph and explain why this has not happened before; that he will explain why he was fooled by the Hofmann forgeries; that he will say why there are no additions to doctrine and covenants; and explain why section 132 on polygamy is still part of mormon scripture; and why the temple still is not built in Independece despite D and C prophecies. Am I dreaming? And yet Mormonoides (their words) still believe this tosh. And yet I fear that this cult still wants to rule the world. - 10/25/2002 - from pimlicoboy
When will those who are sustained as Prophets, Seers, and Revelators begin to exercise their gifts? Imagine the chaos if one of the 12 offered a revelation, or acted as a Seer.
It has been said if you don't use the talent, it will soon be taken away.
I fear that it is too late. - 03/10/2002 - from PT Brigham
I prophecy that this website will not last as long as Joseph Smith's secret plural marriage to his first wife's best friend, Eliza R. Snow. - 08/11/2001 - anon
When will the Corporation of the President pay royalty fees and copyright infringement fines to the American Freemason Society?
According to the prophetic burning within my bosom, I'd have to prophecy that they're going to be asking the AFS for royalties and copyright infringement!
Because, you know, Solomon had it first, and he was LDS!! - 06/05/2001 - anon
Still wondering...when the Mormon Church will admit to killing over 100 people in the Mountain Meadows Massacre?
Add to the fact, when they will admit to loosing authority of Joe Smith?
When will the Mormon Church admit that they do not have all the answers?
Admit that they have killed hundreds in blood atonement?
Admit that they aren't what they claim to be?
Admit that they are only interested in financial gain?
Admit that they are racist?
Admit that Baptism for the dead is a farce?
Admit that Temple Work, is for the brain dead?
Admit that they are a corrupted version of the gospel of Jesus Christ?
Admit that the missionary program and temple work is only for financial gain.
Admit that G.B.Hinkley and all the prophets descending from Joseph Smith are frauds. Inclusive of their present day leadership.
Admit that the only reason that they allow publication of LDS administrators is for financial gain.
Admit that they are complete frauds, invalidated by the standards of both the living and the dead. - 5/20/2001 - R.L. McDonald
I predicted many years ago that some day, the temple endowments would be performed in stake centers. Everyone thought I was nuts!! But the McTemples are just the first step in that direction!! I am vindicated!!!!
I really believe it will happen -- money and time will dictate it. The nextstep will be letting non-members attend the weddings -- bit by bit, I think all the SECRET CRAP will disappear.
And here's another step in that direction: The dedication of the Palmyra temple will be broadcast through the miracle of closed-circuit television in all the stake centers -- but one has to have a temple recommend in order to get in to view the dedication!!!!
Temple recommends to get into the Stake Center? See what I mean?
Little by little -- just found out THIS interesting piece of information from my True Believing Mormon daughter this evening. Who'd uv thunk! What you see before you in Cyberland is the first PROPHETESS of the Cyber-Day Cranks! (Bowing, bowing to all of the applause, Thank you very much!!!) :-)
03/25/2000 - Sue
If all the thinking has been done, I guess we don't need to worry any more. If Boyd K Packer does the thinking, others must do the other stuff too, So we can just go and finish our life by proxy. 10/20/1999 - bigmac
The LDS church is indeed growing...although not nearly as fast as the population as a whole...but it is taken the latter course. Fast growth, but at the cost of far more transitory membership.
You can easily see this in the temple ceremony...church meetings...etc. The ceremony has certainly been watered down since I first went.. (think of this...in the 1840's the endowment lasted 12 hours!!), excommunications don't happen nearly as often...church participation is done by a smaller and smaller group in the ward.. There are many more divorces...etc.....and an interesting twist that I learned about is that there are a large number of people from the ward that I go to that go to another church now...almost unheard of even a few years ago.
I'm sure this is troubling to the older members who were in it when it was a far more isolative and protected meme.
Will the church reach 200 million someday...perhaps...but not without another half a billion in growth of the earth population, and not without a large percentage of them being members on paper only...having little cognition of the belief system. 10/06/1999 - Tom
Regarding temples "dotting the face of the land." We have all witnessed the great move to the mainstream which the church has undergone in the last ten years. I suspect that in ten more you wont be able to tell a mormon from a Presbreterian!
But the temple has always stood out in public as some secretive, spooky thing. (Which it is.) However, with the addtion of 100 mini Mctemples, Hinckley can effectively "normalize" their place in american culture. "Oh, that... its just the local temple...every town has one.!" As people see them more and more, they will just accept them... like a rotary club, or Moose Lodge!
Its a part of the mainstreaming of mormon culture. And, with the new Temple Lite service, with lighter no doubt to come, it just may be that regular old thinking joes may be more easily duped into entering those sacred doors.
Bow your heads and say "yes." - 10/02/1999 - Gary
When will the True church start telling the Truth? 07/24/1999 - anon
When will Boyd Packer grow up? 07/24/1999 - anon
I believe there are two possible futures. The most likely is that church expansion will simply stall. The Hinckster, a master communicator whose messages have have been central to public perceptions both inside and outside the church, can't live forever. Hinckley has tapped into a number of attractive social and political themes to push forward church growth these last few decades. His momentum took advantage of the respectability that came with having a minister of agriculture as the prophet, Ezra Benson. With Hinckley's eventual death, and as societies evolve, the concept of finding personal peace through corporate conformity and collective obedience to a higher authority, will simply lose its mass appeal. Mormonism has had its heyday. Some commentators have said that if this century was characterized by the 'search of outer space,' the next century will be a time where people 'search their inner space.' Mormonism doesn't have much to offer folks who believe that the search for God is a personal quest -- and if the so-called 'breakdown' of society proves anything, it's that broad solutions don't work any more.
My second scenario is that the church doctrine will become so watered down, Mormonism will become more of a lifestyle movement than a church patterned after Christ. The myths of Joseph Smith's restoration are so far removed from mainstream Christian thought, that Mormon theology will never be widely embraced in a Jewish-Christian society. But there's a strong business imperative among church leadership -- growth in membership is seen as essential. I believe the church's emphasis will shift away from its troubling historic roots. Despite all the advertising to the contrary, the real driver of Mormon life is not a relationship with Christ, it's being able to say yes to the questions in the temple recommend interview. The exclusive, supposedly empowering experience of attending the temple will define Mormon life well into the future. Look at how many temples are under consruction today.
The church faces some tough battles ahead, battles beyond its ability to control: free speech, continuing embarrassment in court, media scrutiny, broadening intellectual exposure, shifting public tastes. 25 years from now, I predict the Mormon church will be regarded as a controlling, grotty, strange little organization -- the way it was perceived in the 1940s and 50s. - 07/08/1999 - DHedley
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